Golden monkeys » Los Angeles Zoo

leaf monkeys
08-03-2007

even though china's rent-a-panda scheme has merits in terms of ploughing money back into wildlife conservation, im sure were all aware just how contentious this scheme has been in the past, particularly in the US where zoos have faced court battles to gain permits from Wildlife and Fisheries and all sorts of allegations from welfare groups. i think it damaged zoos credibilty quite a bit (san diego, colombus, toronto), and even though zoos recovered from this in the eyes of the public, animal liberationists have never really forgotten how commercial these early imports really were and still harp on about it.
the scheme is now alot more legit and not only has it generated alot of money for wildlife conservation in China but San Diego particularly has come up with the goods in terms of research.
on the other hand, a recent National Geographic article closely explored the whole scheme and found many US zoos were finding it increasingly hard to afford the pandas. Atlanta was one zoo prepared to bow out of the scheme. although the arrangement is not commercial, the zoo simply couldnt blance their books and justify the cost of renting the animals. according to the zoos, keeping a pair of pandas is many times more expensive then a herd of elephants, the next most expensive zoo animal.
and the birth of a giant panda is a double-edged sword. great news for panda conservation, but the rent increases on the pandas, off-setting any extra revenue generated from the birth.

the golden monkeys, well thats great. but unless some moratorium of understanding could be passed where China's Zoos entered into an international breeding program, whereby this species could be established in captivity then i cant see golden monkeys being anything but a travelling show to the highest bidder.
establishing douc langurs in western zoos??? for now i'd rather see Western Zoos support the Endangered Primate Centre in Vietnam through funding and staff/technical skills then a major emphasis placed on establishing this species ex-situ.
in the future an ex-situ population might be established using zoos like singapore as an interface between Asia and the West. animals captive bred in Singapore could be conditioned to accept humans, etc, and maybe a less-specialised diet, before being exported.
any hurdles facing this species in the past in places like Europe could, conceivably, be rectified; inbreeding, adaption to climate, diet, etc. but a slow and steady approach is probably best. there are lots of endangered species around the world that need help. seeming as though these langurs are lucky enough to have a specialist centre already, the most cost-effective approach to conserving them would probably be to ensure the survival of the centre...

08-03-2007

Decent remarks, depending on one thing in my opinion though which is the number of animals in Vietnam in need on rehabilitation and the room at the centre. If their are many animals in Vietnam in poor condition and the only reason they are not confiscated is because the centre has no room for them, then i'd say ship them over.

You can't expand the centre forever and confiscating and fining the people involved sends a powerfull and important message to the local people. Then the centre can be used to rehabilitate the animals to a good condition and get them ready to ship them to serious zoo's that are willing and able to keep these animals under the perfect conditions needed.

But i guess the "Monkey World approach" would be best. Either adopt a centre in the country of origin, provide them with money and expertise and if they become in dire need of space, import some of the animals (like they do with the Ping-Tung resque centre in ... Thailand i think?) or if that is not available, build one yourself (like they are now doing in Cat Tien national park in Vietnam).

08-03-2007

the EPRC is sponsored by many zoos, especially in germany but also here in australasia and afew others around the globe. the aim of the center is as a rescue center for endangered primates specifically (they do not care for macaques for example) but they also breed the rare primates for eventual release back int the wild. since reintroduction is one of their primary goals, i don't think running out of space is ever going to be a major issue, so long as they have room for more immediate expansions.

09-03-2007

Rumours about a baby Douc Langur at Zoo Cologne, they are also saying all the animals (1.3) are brothers and sisters, so breeding wouldn't be genetically advisable. I heared before they are elderly and hence they didn't think they where going to last long. Still if it's true it can provide valuable information about this rare species... I'll keep you posted on the developments.

14-03-2007

The females at Cologne Zoo are:
leila; *05.03.1987; mother: laraII, father: alex
dolly; *26.03.1987; mother: dunja, father: alex
djung; 01.03.1998; mother: ditja, father: leo
djungs mother ditja (*03.09.1984) is a full sister of dolly.

Only male in the group:
meo; *11.12.2001; mother: leila, father: mischa

Now they have a baby Meo*Djung

According to rumours they were waiting for Leila and Dolly to die and then send Meo and Djung to Asia so they still could play a part in the breeding program, wether or not this baby will change these idea's i don't know...

16-03-2007

I presume these are now the only Douc Langurs in Europe? I guess they have had an unbroken line here since the original group were imported but with births & deaths roughly counteracting each other.

If they rear the new baby maybe they will be stimulated to continue with them though probably they would be better of sending them back to Asia...

16-03-2007

Yup they are now the only Douc's in Europe. Basel had a few not that long ago i heared, but the remainder of that group has been sent to San Diego...

Wheither or not this species should be kept in Europe off course depends on a number of circumstances. In short, there should be a good, stable and reliable source of new blood available from south-east asia and there should be enough zoo's in europe that have the money, expertise and willingness to display this animal under the right conditions (I haven't seen Cologne's exhibit but i heared it's far from ideal). If any if these conditions is not met, the animals are better off in the hands of the EPRC or Singapore Zoo (imo anyways).

I would regret the disappearance of another charismatic and endangered species from the european zoological community though. Too bad the animal list is becoming more bland every minute :S

17-03-2007

well it is too bad really. alaskan residents probably feel that the loss of maggie the elephant from their zoo would lead to it becoming a little 'bland', but lets face it, if these animals cant be maintained for the time being in a sustainable way then get rid of them. zoos in europe, particularly england, still tread a thin line in the terms of justifying themselves in the eyes of the public. animal welfare basket cases, like douc langurs, just become bad statistics, undermining the good work of zoos.
as ive said before there are many endangered species in the world. just because these animals are beautiful and endangered is not a good enough justification to keep them in a region where they display unacceptably high levels of mortality.
conserve these guys in SEAsia first, whether in the wild, propogation facilites or local zoos...

17-03-2007

I think we are all agreed, that sad as it may be, Douc Langurs are an example of a species that for whatever reason, does not flourish in zoos in temperate climates, so they're best kept within South East Asia. Without a sustainable population, there isn't much point in Cologne trying to continue alone with their animals.

19-03-2007

definately, rather than waste these animals in america and europe (by letting them die out) better support singapore with their more successful endevours by sending them there (where i assume they would be very useful)...

19-03-2007

We could definitely use new blood. But the problem now is where to place them. We already have 12 douc langurs in our collection so in order to breed more we need to rehouse a number of them. Since few zoos have them, its really difficult to find good homes for them. We may end up having to send them to dodgy zoos in Indochina, where they may not get the best life, but they'll survive better than in temperate regions.

Is there a reintroduction program for doucs in vietnam? I'm not aware of any other than EPRC.

19-03-2007

maybe singapore zoo could send them to australia zoo

19-03-2007

Might not be a crazy suggestion... Douc Langurs could well flourish in Northern Australia climate wheas they can't in N.America/Europe.

19-03-2007

zooish, the EPRC is the only place i know with a reintroduction program.

has anyone been to zoo negara? does it live up to its reputation? do they house doucs?

20-03-2007

I've been to Zoo Negara, but really long ago. However from what i've heard, little has changed. It's basically your typical Southeast Asian zoo with many rare SEA species but lacks modern management and sufficient funding. It's not as terrible as most other zoos in the region, but no where near the standard of Oz or Singapore zoos. Does it have a reputation patrick? Taiping Zoo was supposedly the better Malaysian zoo until the silly gorilla fiasco tarnished their name.

No there are 'officially' no doucs in Malaysian or Indonesian zoos for that matter. Whether any illegal animals exist, I don't know, but the records say no.