Gorilla Design

21-10-2008

Hi Sandra, It would seem that when armed with the fact!
That gorillas prefer totally enclosed enviroments like Howlettes.
That they are not comfortable with the big glass viewing windows like Lincoln Park and many others.
The zoo community is really not doing such a good job with there gorilla enrichment and care as many would percieve them to be.
Yes of course we have come a long way. Just pointing out there is still a long way to go.

__________________
Stuart R Webster
A small group of thoughtful people could change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
Margaret Mead

21-10-2008

Hi Stuart,

Yes in agreement, sometimes I do wonder if the info already understood and gained through years of stuff that hasn't worked and sometimes has has not been passed from establishment to establishment. Surely this is not difficult to do? Some enclosures are going in the right direction but some have a mountain to climb, but will that mountain ever be scaled, not sure in some places, so yes absolutely I agree, still a long way to go. My heart breaks sometimes, very depressing Especially with some new and 'eagerly awaited' enclosures where the animals are still not the priority!

21-10-2008

My impression is that the large 'openair' enclosures continue to be created because the zoos perceive this is how the public would best like to see the animals displayed- 'oh, look, they've got lots of space to roam around, they must be happy, this is a good zoo, so we'll visit again'... etc.

The fact that the gorillas are psychologically restricted largely to the covered areas within it is of course totally unnoticed by the visiting public. If the zoos realise it they ignore the fact, after all, they need to justify the huge expense, design and layout of the enclosure in the first place. Even at Port Lympne the large outdoor enclosures are similarly little used- however unlike almost anywhere else, their colonies do have the large roofed areas for daily use as well and always look very content in them. I think they were originally designed at Howletts with the roofs to give climbing opportunity but coincidentally have actually also proved the most suitable design since they provide that all important cover as well.

I'm still waiting for a zoo that manages to create a design for Gorillas that works 100% for the Gorillas and the public all in one display.

21-10-2008

[quote=Pertinax;78731

I'm still waiting for a zoo that manages to create a design for Gorillas that works 100% for the Gorillas and the public all in one display.[/QUOTE]


Hope to show this to you 1 day.

__________________
Stuart R Webster
A small group of thoughtful people could change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
Margaret Mead

11-11-2008

DAK. l have just seen pictures of gorillas sitting in water at DAK.

Had not heard of a Gorilla enclosure with a pool that gorillas used. Has it something to do with climate? The gorillas?

I know they do this in the wild. Surely this is a unique feature at DAK. Or have l missed another collection???

__________________
Stuart R Webster
A small group of thoughtful people could change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
Margaret Mead

Gorillas in Water
12-11-2008

On my visit to the Gladys Porter Zoo in Brownsville, Texas last year, I was shocked to see the entire troop playing in the water. The enclosure has an elevated island with a sunken moat. Instead of filling the moat with water to the island edge, the gorillas are given a shallow stream. Of course the youngsters were very playful, but even the silverback got into the act - sitting in the water then using his giant hand to scoop water onto himself. I was mesmerized to see this, I have never seen anything like it before.

Weather might have something to do with it. Brownsville is at the southernmost tip of Texas, on the border with Mexico. It is usually very warm, and this particular day was no different. However, it might just be the product of opportunity. Most zoos are not giving gorillas the opportunity to use a pool. The water feature included is usually a fast running, narrow stream fed by a waterfall. Surely not deep enough for "swimming." If it's being used in Brownsville and DAK, then it might be time to add this feature to a few more zoos.

I'm attaching two of the pictures I took.

Attached Images

	DSC_0024.JPG (1.42 MB, 18 views)
	DSC_0026.JPG (1.49 MB, 15 views)

12-11-2008

Some decades ago, there was a mistaken notion that gorillas won't go into water and so water moats were used. After some animals drowned (Bronx Zoo's case was a famous one) moats were drained.

Zoos have long known gorillas like shallow water.The Bronx Zoo's "Congo Gorilla Forest" also has a small shallow pool for the gorillas.

12-11-2008

True, true, it has also been noted in the wild that Gorillas will use near by water when diplaying to make very big splashes.

12-11-2008

There is also that wild footage of them in that bai, walking through marshland around an elephant.

Great pics
12-11-2008

[quote=Budorcas;82234]On my visit to the Gladys Porter Zoo in Brownsville, Texas last year, I was shocked to see the entire troop playing in the water. The enclosure has an elevated island with a sunken moat. Instead of filling the moat with water to the island edge, the gorillas are given a shallow stream. Of course the youngsters were very playful, but even the silverback got into the act - sitting in the water then using his giant hand to scoop water onto himself. I was mesmerized to see this, I have never seen anything like it before.

Weather might have something to do with it. Brownsville is at the southernmost tip of Texas, on the border with Mexico. It is usually very warm, and this particular day was no different. However, it might just be the product of opportunity. Most zoos are not giving gorillas the opportunity to use a pool. The water feature included is usually a fast running, narrow stream fed by a waterfall. Surely not deep enough for "swimming." If it's being used in Brownsville and DAK, then it might be time to add this feature to a few more zoos.

I'm attaching two of the pictures I took.[/QUOTE

Hi Jon Wassner, "one of the co-authors of America's Best Zoos" Matey l had to read up on you!!

Thoose two pics take my breath away.

Please dont hold back on posting pictures of such high quality.

Hope you don't mind l will be looking to print out and frame the pic of the gorilla on his back.

__________________
Stuart R Webster
A small group of thoughtful people could change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
Margaret Mead

12-11-2008

Zooplantman - Where is the shallow pool in Congo Gorilla Forest? Do they have one in both exhibits? Is it viewable from the public glass area? It's been a while since I've been to the Bronx, I can't picture where the pool(s) are.

Zooman - you are welcome to print and frame. i got very lucky that day. if i wasn't in a hurry to see the entire zoo and drive 6 hours to houston to catch a flight then i would have stayed there all day just watching the gorillas. i was surprised to see such an active multi-generational troop at gladys porter. they were easily the most entertaining part of the entire zoo.

12-11-2008

In Congo Gorilla Forest(Bronx Zoo), the pool is in the "second" gorilla yard, appearing as an extension of the moat that separates the two. It is beside the huge hollow tree.
See plan: http://www.zoolex.org/zoolexstat/pictdir//154/site.jpg

12-11-2008

HI Zooplantman, l am curious was the pool at congo built for the purpose of enrichment for the gorillas? Do they use fully as is shown they do at Gladys Porter Zoo?

__________________
Stuart R Webster
A small group of thoughtful people could change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
Margaret Mead

13-11-2008

Yes and yes. Although that exhibit (Bronx) is huge and has varied topography, climbing opportunities, hills, etc. so they are in the water less then they might be

Gorillas and water.
16-11-2008

Gorillas definately like water. Apart from the examples above, many gorillas in captivity enjoy some water contact, from a spray with hosepipes to wading and splashing in pools and moats.

Its widely thought they can't swim, since there have been a number of drownings in water moats. However, like humans, they can learn- a pair at Ibadan Zoo in Nigeria regularly swam in the water moat of the enclosure with their keeper, they kept their heads out of the water though. Presumably a gorilla which had learnt to swim wouldn't then drown
if it fell into deep water, however few zoos have facilities to teach their gorillas to swim and it would also mean water moats could no longer be used as barriers.