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ZSL London Zoo London Zoo 2014 #3

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by Nisha, 16 Aug 2014.

  1. Nisha

    Nisha Well-Known Member

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  2. Pertinax

    Pertinax Well-Known Member

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    To open this thread, here's a carryon with the discussion about the soon-to-be revamped Lion Terraces area.

    Specifially what will happen to the Monkeys living there?. My opinion is the Zoo would not lose anything by not having any of them. There are four species on show near Gorilla Kingdom. Most visitors don't care what sort of Monkeys they see as long as they've seen some 'cheeky Monkeys'. I would suggest probably either the Spiders or the interactive Mangabeys are the ones best remembered by most visitors after they leave.

    I think the three species in the Lion terrace area, which aren't in very suitable housing anyway, are hardly noticed by comparison. If Primates are included in the new display as has been mentioned, then its likely to be something connected with Indian Lions rather than any of the current species.

    Maybe Whipsnade, lacking any larger Primates bar the Chimps, would benefit by having at least one or two of these species?
     
  3. Panthera1981

    Panthera1981 Well-Known Member

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    The primates will be housed off-show at Whipsnade whilst the lion exhibit is built.

    Ultimately, it's the principle of the thing: London losing more species and it's diversity. I see no reason why the macaques and langurs (both endangered and breeding) couldn't be housed on a re-developed Casson, with a view to incorporating Tiger Territory and the Komodo dragons and, ultimately creating a "mini Indonesia." Move the spider monkeys into the Snowdon and the Serval to Whipsnade (which was the original plan before they got meerkats). The gibbons, being inbred I believe, are a bit of a lost cause.

    Personally, I would LOVE to see more primates at Whipsnade.
     
  4. meriones

    meriones Member

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    I don't think the monkeys on the terraces add a lot to the visit of the average zoo visitor. The monkey exhibits they will remember are the squirrel monkeys and the monkeys in the rainforest exhibit. Probably these species would be better off at Whipsnade where they could have a larger enclosure.
     
  5. Pacu

    Pacu Well-Known Member

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    All fair points. The plan indicates vultures and primates. The general visitor may have seen vultures in the African avairy and primates at Gorilla Kingdom, so what should the other species be in the lion redevelopment and how many lions do you think we will see there - just a pair and any cubs before relocation?
     
  6. Indlovu

    Indlovu Well-Known Member

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    London currently hold 0.3, so they would more than likely hold on to at least two of the girls and bring in a male to join them in the new exhibit.
     
  7. Pertinax

    Pertinax Well-Known Member

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    I think in the plans it mentions having the capacity to hold up to 11 or 12 Lions, if they let them get up to that number of course. So maybe four or five adults, plus cubs bred there.

    Regarding a primate species- the most suitable would probably be Grey/Hanuman Langurs as they occur naturally in the Lions' habitat in India.
    They make a good display too.
     
  8. Shirokuma

    Shirokuma Well-Known Member

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    The initial artwork certainly suggests that is the case

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Panthera1981

    Panthera1981 Well-Known Member

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    What happened to the Hanumans that were on the Mappins with the sloth bears?

    Regarding last nights episode of "The Zoo," it's states that they hope to breed their Pygmy hippos. If Thug and Nicky have been together for 10 years, as was stated, surely they would have bred by now or moved on?
     
  10. Pertinax

    Pertinax Well-Known Member

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    They gradually dwindled, the last time I saw them there were just two left. I don't know what happened to them after that. I think like the Bears, they were also of the Sri Lankan subspecies.

    Hippos-possibly they hope the change of enclosure will help stimulate them though I can't see how really. Maybe it was just said for the programme and the reality is they will need a change of partners.
     
  11. Pertinax

    Pertinax Well-Known Member

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    I like these sort of mock-ups. The child in the foreground looks up to no good...;)
     
  12. Jedd Cullinan

    Jedd Cullinan Well-Known Member

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  13. IanRRobinson

    IanRRobinson Well-Known Member

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    I dare say I'll get attacked for being negative, but has anybody seen the present status of Semnopithecus (entellus langurs)in Europe? Two collections hold S.hector, whilst the rest are simply generic animals - in other words, of no conservation importance.

    As for holding 11-12 lions; well, that's not how lions live in the Gir Forest. Most prides have only two females. Exceptionally, they might hold five. When the biggest natural prey item is Nilgai, and the thicker cover allows males to hunt successfully for themselves they don't need to behave like lions do in East Africa.

    Vultures - different story. ZSL's contribution to the conservation of Indian vultures is something worth shouting about, and surely far more important than anything it might do with Asiatic Lions.

    As far as the rest is concerned; it's been said before that for a capital city zoo to only have two species of cat is sad, but why only four species of monkey? A good, representative show of monkeys is something that could be achieved at London very easily, either by the utilisation of the Snowdon Aviary (which I'd personally demolish!!), by use of the canal banks, or by re-interpreting the West African theming of Gorilla Kingdom (somewhat flawed now by having Red-faced Spider Monkeys!), or a combination of these. Why must London Zoo ALWAYS be in the business of reducing its mammal collection?
     
  14. Pertinax

    Pertinax Well-Known Member

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    Yes, its true Asiatic Lions have a different pride/hunting system. I'm sure I saw it written somewhere that the new area would be designed to hold 'up to 11-12 Lions'. Maybe they will be two groups( though I can't really see the point in that).

    I'd be happy to see more Monkey species in London- provided they were housed properly. I don't regard the ones in the Lion area as in that category really. I wish they would make more of the ones they have got anyway- even in the Gorilla Kingdom area, apart from the Mangabeys' outside, they are effectively still living in what's left of the Sobell accomodaton.:(
     
  15. Panthera1981

    Panthera1981 Well-Known Member

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    If ZSL wants a sponsor for the Asian lion exhibit I suggest Kellogs Frosties-they're "Giiiirrrreate!" (see what I did there?)

    Just have to dress Tony the Tiger in the appropriate outfit-I'm sure the zoo have one of those "lion" around somewhere!
     
  16. TeaLovingDave

    TeaLovingDave Moderator Staff Member

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    Do not forget the single Semnopithecus vetulus monticola at Cotswold Wildlife Park and the single Semnopithecus johnii at Erfurt!

    It is a shame that S. priam was permitted to die out in European collections - up until 5 years or so ago about four collections held the taxon.
     
  17. Gary

    Gary Well-Known Member

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    Eh? That's some twisted logic! Tony The TIGER to sponsor a LION exhibit? Yes I got your Gir joke!

    Surely Lion Bars would be more appropriate? :)
     
  18. volvox

    volvox Well-Known Member

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    I don't think it's fair to say London only has four species of monkey Ian – presumably you're thinking of the big ones (spider, mangabey, Diana, colobus, macaque) but there are also squirrel monkeys, red titi, and Goeldis, and loads of tamarins and marmosets – aren't they monkeys? ('scuse my ignorance).
     
  19. Shirokuma

    Shirokuma Well-Known Member

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    Certainly from a visitor point of view I don't think the average person would leave the zoo thinking they'd been hard done by a lack of monkeys.

    In particular the squirrel monkeys and rainforest seem to be very popular and memorable 'experiences' of getting up close to monkeys and the mangabeys seem to be a good and active display.

    I'd love to see the colobus, for example, in more impressive accommodation. Their current set up doesn't show them off to their greatest potential.

    I still think that quality is more important than quantity.
     
  20. Pertinax

    Pertinax Well-Known Member

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    Colobus look good with their long flowing coats, they breed freely and the white babies are cute to see. Unfortunately they are rather inactive for periods, sitting doing nothing and they tend not to interact with people(which may be seen as either a desirable or undesirable trait...). But the bigger the enclosure, the more active they become and the better they show their leaping/bounding abilities. They would have displayed better in the open Gorilla enclosure than in the regulation cage they are in now.

    Mangabeys and Macaques are mostly more active species. So are Hanuman Langurs which is why I hope they bring them into the Lion exhibit.