A £55 million expansion plan, of which we know most of, but they are extending an orang-utan enclosure; Twycross Zoo to spend £55 million on expansion plan | Leicester Mercury
I find the figure of 55 million pounds an enormous amount of money. The orang house is to refurbished, that is a good thing as it could certainly do with it, interesting that there is no mention of the proposed new Chimp Eden in these plans although a water park for children and yet another café is.
Blimey, did I get out of the wrong side of bed today. Firstly, it's great that Twycross have a vision, though I hope they didn't spend too much on it. But... The announcement does smack a little of political-like spin and, from the news story I saw, seems largely aspirational rather than any firm timetable for improvements (which, let's face it, is difficult at any zoo). The news story said it was a twenty year plan which seems to provide a lot of flex for the management not delivering anything significant for a while and allows time for the public to forget what was planned/promised. I'm cynical through experience as I've heard these things from Twycross many times before. I'd love to be proven wrong and have a great zoo on my doorstep but for an organisation that's tried (and failed) three or four times to sort out the parking area in a dozen or so years I'll keep my fingers crossed and believe it when I see it. With regards to the Orangs I personally think it'd be best for Twycross to go out of them. For the cost of doing Orangs right they could probably do up most of the rest of the zoo. In reality I know I'm in a minority and Twycross are unlikley to go out of them but I've got a "if you can't do something properly within a reasonable timescal don't do it" attitude. The Chimps and Orangs have been kept in sub-standard, outdated, facilties for too long and deserve a lot better sooner than Twycross could probably facilitate. This argument is probably short-circuited by the fact that they won't spend a lot on the improvements so any related cash couldn't be spent elsewhere but that would just means that any improvements will be cosmetic/minor and the facilities will still be below par in the future. I could be wrong (and hope I am), wonders can happen, time will tell.........
They will (perhaps unfortunately) never do that. Nor do they appear to be building them new quarters either- an 'extension' is what is mentioned. How much this changes things remains to be seen but at the least it will mean improved/more spacious indoor quarters and better facilities for keeping animals separated when they need to. Their website contains no Press Release(yet) about all this, but it does say the Gibbon House is now closed/empty. Someone commented (on a deleted thread) that there is less 'singing' by the Twycross Gibbons now. I did notice this myself recently. I attribute it to the fact they may have rather less Gibbons than previously- for example there are now only 3-4 Pileateds, and I saw less Siamangs too. This could be in preparation for the new planned 'island' Housing which will house only four family units(of four different species). Oh yes, the Car Park... Its still a poor advert for arriving visitors. Why don't they completely tarmac it?
I fear you may be right, but I very much hope you are wrong; I'd love it if this collection were to lift itself from the doldrums it has inexorably sailed into over the years. I do agree, however, that were the collection to go out of Orangs it would greatly benefit the welfare of the other ape taxa held there - however I doubt this will happen, as it would destroy their already counter-factual claim to have every species of Great Ape
It is obvious they look like they are going out of animals and just going to be a theme park instead my question is where the hell are they going to put this water park for children laugh is they can not even look after the customers they have now, what about the penguins? The management are not bothered with the animal. Why do a water park for the children they couldn't get the beach right last year it was a paddling pool, a pile of builders sand and a large deck chair nothing else and where are they going to put it ? plus they are going to need first aiders and life savers because of the water, it will be a flop because of global warming which we are going to get wetter summers if only Mrs Boardman hadn't of dug up the car parks for the waterways perhaps they are going to use them.
I see no reason whatsoever why this zoo should go out of orangs, it would appear that they are going to do what Blackpool has done, that is refurbish and extend a building of similar age and style. I cannot comprehend how going out of orangs would benefit the other species of great ape currently residing at Twycross, not at all. And as for the car park, I wouldn't even think it would be necessary to tarmac it, although it would be good if it was, how about just filling the pot holes in, the same goes with the pathways, that would only costs hundreds, not thousands.
I understand that this new gibbon exhibit will comprise of three islands which will only need a smaller number of animals that lived in the gibbon complex, where are the gibbons going to go/have gone that will not be needed for this new exhibit, have they been rehoused elsewhere in the zoo, have some been sent to other collections or whatever?
The new accomodation will have four islands. All the Gibbons they currently have are now housed elsewhere in the Zoo- I don't know whether all are still on show or some are offshow. Nor do I know if their numbers have actually been reduced or not, apart from what I saw myself. For example, the Pileateds I can remember when there were several pairs in several enclosures- now there is just one of three/four, housed on the other side of the Zoo( they had been moved the day of my visit) I was told that those they still had which were not intended for the new housing would still be kept in other enclosures. But of course when the new accomodation is built, I have no idea how many animals that might actually entail.
Orangutans. Blackpool have(afaik) built a completely new indoor House for theirs, but they still have the old original outside enclosure. I am not clear if this( the outside) will be completely redone in time, or just 'improved'. Re Twycross carpark- the trouble is filling in potholes won't help the wet weather situation of parking on soft land. I think they should just spend the money and tarmac the whole area.
I hate the carpark there, I don't remember an issue before it was re-done but then I only visited once or twice before it was re-done. Filling in will not help it needs all digging up and a decent capping layer placed to reduce/alleviate the sinking. They tried using a plastic mesh to reinforce and stop the movement of the surface course but this clearly has not worked. I would hate for them to asphalt the car park, zoos should be looking at sustainability and setting an example.....something I can only scratch my head at when zoos are bringing in stuff from South East Asia to make it authentic, what message is that sending? (maybe it is a whole other thread)
I have a feeling that the new gibbon exhibit is going to act as a precursor to new great ape housing in the same style. Like, they'll see how it works out and how the visitors and the animals enjoy it and if they can scrape up enough money they'll attempt build ape houses in a similar aesthetic. It would take a lot of money though, so unlike with gibbons maybe they'll build them an island at a time? Twycross isn't perfect but the people who run it aren't stupid (I'd hope). I'm sure they're all well aware of the problems that the current ape housing causes in the animals, and they will want to fix these problems as quickly as possible!
BBC News - Twycross Zoo £55m revamp to include great apes centre Apparently my guess was not far off. 'Chimpanzee Eden' will be opening in 2016, seemingly followed by new housing for each of the ape species. Excellent news!
I will not hold my breath just yet,as its all plans at the moment,when they start breaking ground to build these plans,then I will start to get excited!!
Didn't the 'Kuno' project get to this sort of stage too, but then no further? Of course I would very much like to see this happen for the Chimps. And if these proposals really are to encompass the other Ape species in time, then the planned work on the existing Orangutan building is most likely to be only an interim measure, but again any improvements are welcome.
I think the real question here, rather than whether it happens or not, is what will actually be achieved if it does. Scant as information might be at this early stage, the images in the BBC article aren't exactly inspiring. Captive environments for great apes have come a long way since mowed grass islands with solid back walls and moats - Vallee des singes and Apenheul are what Twycross should be looking towards. There are mature trees on-site, we'll see if any are located remotely near this in the plans. In their absence, hopefully something along the lines of Chester's telegraph pole forest for its chimpanzee group, with at least a living understorey of bushes, will be attempted in the actual build, otherwise this will just be a shiny combined version of the existing enclosures, condemning resident apes to many decades more of sitting on lawns without so much as a hotwired sapling to even sit under, let alone climb. The caveat here is that there is of course scope for plans to develop and change, in fact there is no reason to assume they haven't already, but it is worth pointing out that many bad ape enclosures still get opened today, and so many establishments struggle to manage live vegetation or anything like a canopy in most exhibits. It's very, very welcome news that the investment is proposed, and I'm sure the indoor quarters will be a massive improvement, but if that kind of money is to be spent, why not create habitats that acutally resemble the forest environments these species inhabit in the wild?
£55 million is an awful lot of money - even when spread over 20 years. I fear there may be plenty of hype here. £10 million over 3 years is more realistic aim; I want to see how the new gibbon house (which looks good on paper) and the new chimp facility turn out before I get too excited over the other plans. I fear the orangs may be nearer the bottom of the queue. Alan
