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Zoochat Cup Group H: Chester vs Prague

Discussion in 'ZooChat Cup' started by CGSwans, 12 Nov 2019.

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Chester vs Prague: Carnivores

Poll closed 14 Nov 2019.
  1. Chester 3-0 Prague

    2.2%
  2. Chester 2-1 Prague

    48.9%
  3. Prague 2-1 Chester

    46.7%
  4. Prague 3-0 Chester

    2.2%
  1. CGSwans

    CGSwans Well-Known Member 15+ year member

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    The final first round match is among the most consequential we've had. Two European super-heavyweights with Cup-winning credentials, but Prague is in serious danger of elimination if it can't scrounge a win (and might miss out even if it does). Chester will progress with a win, but a heavy defeat could see it tumble out instead.

    The topic? Carnivores.
     
  2. amur leopard

    amur leopard Well-Known Member 5+ year member

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  3. Brum

    Brum Well-Known Member 10+ year member

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  4. amur leopard

    amur leopard Well-Known Member 5+ year member

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    Prague species list:

    Amur leopard
    Asiatic lion
    Brown hyena
    Bush dog
    Cape fur seal
    Central African ratel
    Caracal
    Dwarf mongoose
    Eurasian wolf
    Fennec fox
    Fishing cat
    Geoffroy's cat
    Indochinese clouded leopard
    Indochinese smooth-coated otter
    Jaguarundi
    Javan leopard
    Malayan tiger
    Maned wolf
    Meerkat
    Nepalese red panda
    North American river otter
    Northern raccoon
    Oncilla
    Palawan binturong
    Palawan leopard cat
    Philippine palm civet
    Polar bear
    Siberian tiger
    South African bat-eared fox
    South African cheetah
    South American coati
    Sri Lankan rusty spotted cat
    Sumatran tiger
    Tayra
    White-nosed coati
    Yellow mongoose

    So that's Prague 36 - 19 Chester in species...
     
  5. lintworm

    lintworm Well-Known Member 15+ year member

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    Prague does however not have the enclosures to beat Chester, with the Polar bear and quite a number of the Cat enclosures being quite poor.
     
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  6. vogelcommando

    vogelcommando Well-Known Member 10+ year member

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    And again a competition from which I only know 1 collection personaly. At Prague Zoo I found the carnivore collection quite impressive with a number of rare and rarely seen species and even a lifer on subspecies level ( Palawan leopard cat ). Some of the enclosure were very large ( Cheetah , Brown hyena - althrough the species himself was not visuable ), others were a little bit small and one - the Polar bear was IMO very small.
    Overall I found it one of the better carnivore-collections I've seen and because I've not seen Chesters carnivore-collection myself - althrough there's written quite a lot about here on ZooChat - I'll give a 2-1 score for Prague.
     
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  7. FunkyGibbon

    FunkyGibbon Well-Known Member

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    I think as well that whilst the bat-eared fox and ratel enclosures are not bad they are not fantastic either. I will be voting 2-1 to Chester based on exhibit quality.
     
  8. twilighter

    twilighter Well-Known Member 10+ year member

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    Sadly, one of the those two fantastic zoos, witch could fight in a Final four will perhaps leave the game. Prague is awesome zoo with one of the biggest and most diverse Carnivore collection I have seen , but Chester's Spirit of Jaguar, Giant Otter and Fossa exhibits are in the league of it's own.I will vote for Chester 2:1 now, but could be convinced to change side.
     
    Last edited: 12 Nov 2019
  9. amur leopard

    amur leopard Well-Known Member 5+ year member

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    OK I agree that the polar bear enclosure is poor but it is being redone into a massive exhibit, so....
    Secondly, I would certainly not say that some of the cat exhibits are extremely poor... If you refer to the oncilla, one that is mediocre at worst...!
    Here are some photos of Prague:

    Thanks to @HOMIN96 , @lintworm and @Robaque especially (I think)

    So starting with smaller species:

    prague jaguarundi.jpg

    prague oncilla.jpg

    prague tayra.jpg
    prague leopard cat.jpg

    So these (I'm guessing) are the 'quite poor' enclosures. I would not even say that it approaches poor, although my benchmark may well be lower than yours @lintworm.
    The top exhibit for jaguarundis is well-planted, with lots of space and many places to hide. It is a good exhibit. The entrance to the oncilla exhibit viewing tunnel is shown in the second photo. I couldn't find a picture showing the actual exhibit, but from the small view we have of it, I imagine it is similar-ish to the jaguarundi exhibit and same with the tayras in the third photo. Then, the leopard cats. While the exhibit may look slightly shabby, the enclosure itself is suitable and good. There is plenty of height to the enclosure, allowing the cats to climb as they would in the wild. Therefore, the bad exhibits aren't actually bad at all really...

    prague half coati enclosure.jpg
    This is a small section of the coati exhibit, which is lushly planted, with lots of natural climbing opportunities as well as viewing opportunities for visitors. This makes it a very good exhibit for a species often overlooked in zoos.

    prague cape fur seal.jpg
    prague cape fur seal 2.jpg

    The second photo shows the extent of the exhibit properly, while the first shows a small section. It is a spacious and well-proportioned exhibit with a slide, clear water and a long range of viewing windows. A good exhibit on the whole.

    prague bush dog.jpg
    This immense exhibit for bush dogs is outstanding compared to the exhibits this species is normally housed in. Very spacious and impressive.

    praguenorth american river otter.jpg
    Meanwhile, the otter exhibit is also very large and well-suited to the species. It also has large viewing windows.

    prague red panda.jpg

    And lastly, probably the best and most striking red panda exhibit I have ever seen, it reflects the red panda's mountainous home, while being based around Nepalese trees and the dense foliage reflets the thick tops of the trees of the Nepalese mountain forests in which they live. the photo only shows part of the enclosure. The exhibit is also built on a natural slant, which also allows visitors to view from above and below.

    More in the next post.
     
  10. FunkyGibbon

    FunkyGibbon Well-Known Member

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  11. ThylacineAlive

    ThylacineAlive Well-Known Member 10+ year member

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    While Prague does have Chester beat out species-wise and while I don't entirely agree with the degree to which Prague's enclosures have been described (Polar Bear definitely aside), I think Chester has the win here. Chester is a zoo that is actively working on importing new and endangered species, and is willing to be one of the first to join in on new captive programs (vontsirsa, mongoose). They also have some pretty fantastic enclosures that do beat Prague's overall. The Giant Otter enclosure in particular is superb, and from photos it looks like they arguably have the best Fossa enclosure around. On top of all of that, they do excellent conservation work in several countries around the globe. Their Scottish Wildcat complex is even completely bts so that the cats may potentially be reintroduced back into the wild. 2-1 Chester for me.

    ~Thylo
     
  12. TeaLovingDave

    TeaLovingDave Moderator Staff Member 10+ year member

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    Minor correction - Herpestes auropunctatus.

    This is quite a painful round, as I personally think both of these collections deserve to progress over their two rivals :p but this cannot be, so we just have to tackle things head-on.

    Prague is the superior collection in terms of species (both number and diversity), this is without doubt... but Chester isn't too shabby in this regard either and has the better exhibit quality overall in my opinion.

    I may detail the factors on both sides in more depth anon, but for now ...

    2-1 Chester
     
  13. TeaLovingDave

    TeaLovingDave Moderator Staff Member 10+ year member

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    I'm rather interested to know the answer to this one too :p

    On another note, I wonder how many of us have visited both collections - probably the majority, for once.
     
  14. amur leopard

    amur leopard Well-Known Member 5+ year member

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    I have not.

    However, I do plan to visit in a few years' time after the San Diego and Monterey trip and Berlin, Leipzig, Chester and a few other places. I have however visited Chester before, and after looking through the whole Prague gallery I can assure you that I do know what the enclosures look like.
    Note: I did not immediately start off with a pre-set idea of who I wanted to win, I don't do that. It is only now that I have looked through both galleries and species lists that I am making my mind up.
    And here are the other enclosures: Prague brown hyena.jpg
    prague hyena containment.jpg
    OK Prague is one of the only zoos in the world with brown hyenas, and they don't house them in meagre accommodation either. This immense exhibit is basically devoted to the species. They have isolation areas, connecting areas and containment areas. It is truly immense.

    prague cheetah.jpg
    This massive cheetah exhibit is very suitable for the species. Probably one of the best enclosures for the species in the world apart from Beauval's.

    prague asiatic lion.jpg
    This is another large enclosure and lots of places to hide (for Asiatic lions) I know you can't see the enclosure very well, but it is good in other photos.

    prague javan leopard.jpg
    An average enclosure for Javan leopards. Could do with a little more space but enough places to hide.

    prague malayan tiger.jpg
    This is the Malayan tiger exhibit and I genuinely think it is a good enclosure. It has cover, it has a massive pool for these water-loving cats and it is far enough away to give the cats some privacy.

    prague maned wolf.jpg
    This is a massive exhibit for maned wolves. Very nice exhibit overall, representing the Pampas well.

    prague siberian tiger.jpg

    The Siberian tiger exhibit is also very nice, simulating the Russian taiga. Although you can't really see the exhibit, it is large and spacious.


    Also, Prague's species list basically blows Chester's out of the water:
    If you delete all species that are in both collections...

    Amur leopard
    Brown hyena
    Cape fur seal
    Central African ratel
    Caracal
    Eurasian wolf
    Fennec fox
    Fishing cat
    Geoffroy's cat
    Indochinese clouded leopard
    Indochinese smooth-coated otter
    Jaguarundi
    Javan leopard
    Malayan tiger
    Maned wolf
    North American river otter
    Northern raccoon
    Oncilla
    Palawan leopard cat
    Philippine palm civet
    Polar bear
    Siberian tiger
    South African bat-eared fox
    South American coati
    Sri Lankan rusty spotted cat
    Tayra
    White-nosed coati
    Yellow mongoose

    African wild dog
    Asian small-clawed otter
    Fossa
    Giant otter
    Grandidier’s Vontsira
    Jaguar
    Northern Narrow-striped boky
    Scottish wildcat
    Spectacled Bear
    Sun bear


    3 subspecies of tiger, 2 of leopard, brown hyenas... what more can you ask for?
     
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  15. pipaluk

    pipaluk Well-Known Member 10+ year member

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    Worth noting also that 4 of Chester's are offshow too! How many of Prague's are offshow? Offshow shouldn't necessarily be discounted, but I don't think they should carry quite the same weight as what you can see. Take out the offshow species and Prague has well over twice as many and interesting species too! If Chester didn't have good exhibits this would be 3-0 Prague for me. I voted 2-1 though
     
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  16. pipaluk

    pipaluk Well-Known Member 10+ year member

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    You haven't voted though!
     
  17. amur leopard

    amur leopard Well-Known Member 5+ year member

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    Which ones are offshow from Chester? This could be very significant...
     
  18. pipaluk

    pipaluk Well-Known Member 10+ year member

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    Grandidiers Vontsira
    Narrow striped Boky
    Javan Mongoose
    Scottish Wildcat
    I think
     
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  19. snowleopard

    snowleopard Well-Known Member 15+ year member Premium Member

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    Is Prague, a strong candidate for the best zoo in Europe, really going to tumble out of the competition? Is it the luck of the draw that is seeing zoos like Prague, Pairi Daiza, Miami and Burgers all get booted...or what other explanation can there be? Burgers' Zoo has superb exhibits but not a huge collection of animals, but those other zoos are massive, all-day zoos with not only lots of species but also very good exhibits. This tournament is throwing up some curveballs and that is making things very exciting.
     
  20. amur leopard

    amur leopard Well-Known Member 5+ year member

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    I would say it point blank is the best zoo in Europe...
    I think Prague does certainly deserve to get close to winning this competition, which is part of the reason why I am campaigning for it...