Join our zoo community

Crocodilia Offspring in Zoos

Discussion in 'General Zoo Discussion' started by Nikola Chavkosk, 9 Aug 2016.

  1. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia
    What do you know/think, what is the general make-up of the crocodilians offspring produced in zoos (only in zoos, excluding commercial crocodile farms) in the last 10-15 years?

    Wich crocodilians babies are most numerous/most intensively produced in zoos? Are they mostly endangered (threatened) babies, or are not threatened like American alligator or Nile crocodile?

    Here I mean on all crocodilia species, including alligators, caimans, gharial and false gharial.

    Are there zoos breeding Nile crocodiles?
    Are there zoos sourcing less-treatened crocodilians from crocodile farms (in tropics).

    I would wrote that make-up of crocodilians babies produced in the last 10-15 years in zoos are mostly:
    Babies of dwarf crocodile (3 species)
    Babies of American alligator (US)
    Babies of Cuban crocodile
    Babies of Chinese alligator
    Babies of Morlet's crocodile (in Europe mostly in UK) (ZTL)

    Are there recent successes of breeding of slender snouted crocodiles (2 species), caimans (relatively numerous in zoos - captive bred?), Orinoco river crocodile, gharial (outside India)?

    Are zoos shifting and phasing out non-treathened species like Nile crocodiles and American alligators, for place for more threatened species?

    I rarely read info like this about crocodiles hatchings.

    I asked many questions, but please consider this as general discussion and every info is welcomed.
     
    Last edited: 11 Aug 2016
  2. Batto

    Batto Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    3 Sep 2013
    Posts:
    1,112
    Location:
    Baltic Sea
    You omitted Siamese crocs.

    "crocman" would have been the main contact for this thread, but unfortunately, he passed away. RIP.
     
  3. jayjds2

    jayjds2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    10 Nov 2015
    Posts:
    2,017
    Location:
    Virginia, USA
    In the AZA, this is what applies:

    All crocodilian species are still being managed. However, zoos are asked to consider a switch from a large common species (such as Nile) to a smaller endangered one (slender snouted, dwarf, etc.).

    Most large crocs (Nile, saltwater) are sourced from farms in their native countries. The only breeding pair of saltwater crocs in the US that I know of are at St. Augustine Alligator Farm Zoological Park.

    I'm not positive about breeding successes in African slender-snouted crocodiles, dwarf crocodiles, caimans, or Morelet's crocodiles. I do know that SAAFZP had very young baby slender-snouted crocodiles and broad-snouted caimans on exhibit.

    Tomistoma are very hard to breed in captivity. Only five zoos in the US have managed to do it, and I only know of three: San Antonio Zoo, SAAFZP, and Audubon Zoo. The Saint Louis Zoo is trying to breed them but isn't doing so well considering that for 18 years they had two females together. If a zoo or aquarium wants them, they can import some from a farm in Malaysia.

    The Orinoco crocodile has been bred by two facilities outside of its native range. The first was the Dallas World Aquarium, which had bred it multiple times and released about 50 into the wild when they were about four feet long. The second, which bred them for the first time this year, is the Gladys Porter Zoo.

    The Indian gharial has been bred three times outside of its native range, but only one animal has hatched. Some zoo in Europe has done it (not sure which). The Fort Worth Zoo had a gravid (egg carrying female) that sadly died in transport from an old exhibit to the current one. The SAAFZP bred them last year (two infertile eggs) and successfully hatched one this year, the first ever hatch outside its native range.

    Hope I helped :).

    Edit: now that I think about it, the Dallas Zoo hatched two west African dwarf crocodiles last year. There is also one at SAAFZP sitting on a nest.
     
  4. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia
    Thank you a lot jayjds2, you helped a lot.
    Just what zoo is SAAFZP? - got it St. Augustine Aligator Farm Zoological Park.
    I knew it that caimans are not easy to breed in captivity. I am wonder now whether there is any zoo that bred Nile crocodiles :)
    Great job done for Orinoco crocodile.
     
    Last edited: 9 Aug 2016
  5. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia
    Batto I omitted several, I didn't mention it, but any info for all are highly welcomed. Species that I didn't mentioned are among others, also muger crocodile, American crocodile, New Guinea crocodile, Phillippine crocodile etc.
     
    Last edited: 9 Aug 2016
  6. lintworm

    lintworm Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    27 Oct 2008
    Posts:
    1,764
    Location:
    Switzerland
    Phillipine crocodile are successfully bred in Cologne.

    Fals Gharials have been bred in Europa by Fuengirola and recently Pierelatte.

    Emmen had a pair of Slender-snouted crocodiles (not sure which species of the two) which bred very successful and they are now in Blijdorp Rotterdam. Their offspring found home all over Europe.
     
  7. Batto

    Batto Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    3 Sep 2013
    Posts:
    1,112
    Location:
    Baltic Sea
    I mentioned Siamese crocs in particular because they tend to breed relatively well in captivity, also due to providing good parental care of the offspring.
     
  8. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia

    Thank you both. Is this stupid - to thank all the time? :) - I just want to confirm that I have read and to thanks.

    I didn't knew it that about Siamese crocodile (good parental care for the offspring) (I know they are smuggled a lot to China).

    I have found some additional info on google about recent breeding success of several Crocodilia taxa I will summarize soon in a post.
     
  9. jayjds2

    jayjds2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    10 Nov 2015
    Posts:
    2,017
    Location:
    Virginia, USA
    You got it correct, I was just tired of typing that all out.

    Siamese crocodile is no longer being bred to be kept in captivity in America. Both the Denver Zoo and the SAAFZP hatched some this year. Denver sent theirs to St. Augustine and both clutches are being raised from the same parents. Eventually they will be released to the wild.

    Philippine crocodile has been bred in St. Augustine and Gladys Porter Zoo.

    Both mugger crocodile and New Guinea crocodile are extremely rare in US public collections (perhaps two collections for each). St. Augustine has bred both.

    Any others, feel free to ask.
     
  10. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia
    Thank you jayjds2 seems that you are very good/enthusiastic, I appologise If you got tired typing.
    Just for Chinese aligator - it's status in American zoos?
     
  11. jayjds2

    jayjds2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    10 Nov 2015
    Posts:
    2,017
    Location:
    Virginia, USA
    I don't mind helping with information, it's just that "St. Augustine Alligator Farm Zoological Park" gets to be quite a lot of I have to type it over and over, so I just abbreviate it.

    I don't know how the Chinese alligators are doing in the US. There are a lot of them around, but I don't know if they or breeding (or if we are even trying to breed them).
     
  12. Gulo gulo

    Gulo gulo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    7 Apr 2012
    Posts:
    949
    Location:
    northern forest
    Rest In Peace, Ralf. :(
     
  13. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia
    Some findings from Google: typing dwarf crocodile hatched zoo, crocodile hatching zoo, rare crocodile hatchings zoo, Nile crocodile hatched zoo, slender snouted corcodile hatched zoo, Cuban crocodile hatched zoo, Chinese alligator hatching zoo, caiman hatched zoo, summarized news that I have found:

    -30 June 2016, Smithsonian's National zoo: hatched 5 Cuban crocs;

    -22 June 2016, ZSL Whipsnade zoo: hatched 4 West African dwarf crocodile - endangered babies :p - first time in 18 years (the parrents, 39 years old!);

    - 13 October 2015, Bristol zoo: hatched 5 West African dwarf crocs;

    -July 29th - August 7th, 2015, Smithsonian's National zoo: hatched 5 Cuban crocs;

    - 2 May 2015, Crocodile zoo, Protivin: hatched 1 Phillippine croc;
    - 2 May 2013, Crocodile zoo, Protivin (Czech Republic): hatched 7 Phillippine crocs; Cologne zoo and Crocodile zoo in Protivin the only in Europe that have bred this species.
    - 8 October 2014, Crocodile zoo, Protivin: hatched spectacled caimans (don't stated how many).

    - 24 August 2012, Skansen zoo, Stockholm, Sweden: hatched 16 Cuban crocodiles (parrents smuggled via Moscow, Russia, from Cuba) ( World's rarest crocodiles hatched in Swedish zoo - The Local );

    - 8 June 2012, Crocodile zoo, Protivin: first Muger crocodile born in Europe.

    - 27 & 28th March 2012, Crocodile zoo Protivin: laid 15 eggs from gharial.

    - 29 August 2011, Lao zoo, Laos: hatched 20 Siamese crocs;
     
  14. Zoovolunteer

    Zoovolunteer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    4 Dec 2008
    Posts:
    182
    Location:
    Bristol,UK
    For Bristol zoo in the UK, their pair of dwarf crocs usually lay every year. The five from last year were incubated naturally in their enclosure and are still with the parents. 2 older juveniles are in a separate pool. In the past they have actually taken eggs away to avoid producing unrehomable offspring.
     
  15. Gulo gulo

    Gulo gulo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    7 Apr 2012
    Posts:
    949
    Location:
    northern forest
    Maybe in AZA... There are a number of private keepers that keep siamensis and many other crocodylian species. Just becase the Overlords of the AZA have derp'd taxa, doesn't mean jack about the status of crocodylians in America.

    Nikola, don't bother quoting. I won't reply. Do your own "star search"..
     
  16. jayjds2

    jayjds2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    10 Nov 2015
    Posts:
    2,017
    Location:
    Virginia, USA
    Thanks Gulo gulo, to clarify all my statements are for AZA unless other specified. When I say America (in this thread at least) I am implying "AZA accredited zoos of America".

    About the Siamese crocs: if another AZA institution wanted them (which is unlikely but possible) it wouldn't be hard for them to get offspring from another institution.
     
  17. vogelcommando

    vogelcommando Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    10 Dec 2012
    Posts:
    11,623
    Location:
    fijnaart, the netherlands
    For the Cuvier's dwarf caiman Cologne has bred them really in the 100-ths ! They have been spread all over Europe and must be one of the most commonly kept crocodilian species !
    Frankfurt has done very well with the Johnson's crocodile ( freshwater crocodile ) and several of the young are now kept in other collections ( among them the Opel Zoo.
     
  18. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia
    Thank you all for info.

    ps.
    I wonder whether the slender-snouted crocodiles can be successfully kept and bred in large numbers in crocodile farms in the tropics, like many other crocodiles (eg. Cuban, Nile, freshwater, American alligator). Is there any farm with slender-snouteds?

    It seems that Crocodilia in most desperate situation for conservation, are those praehistoric looking, like slender-snouted crocodiles, gharial, and false-gharial (and who breed very difficult in captivity and/or have slow reproductive rate in wild (like incubation period for eggs of slender-snouted frequently exceeds 105 days).
     
  19. Nikola Chavkosk

    Nikola Chavkosk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    17 Feb 2016
    Posts:
    1,322
    Location:
    Prilep, R. Macedonia
    Beside, some species, like Philippine crocodile, Orinoco river crocodile, who also are very rare, but who, judging from their closest relatives (other Crocodylus spp.) can have big potential to florish (baby boom) in crocodile farms in tropics/in captivity. Chinese alligator would be a simmilar case.
     
  20. Bib Fortuna

    Bib Fortuna Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18 Dec 2010
    Posts:
    852
    Location:
    Tatooine
    On May 4, 14 Indian Gharials hatched at Crocodile Zoo Protivin n in Czech-second breeding of the species outside of Asia, and first in europe:)
     
    Nikola Chavkosk likes this.