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Monkey World Ape Rescue Centre Falling out of love with Monkey World

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by monkeyarmy, 26 Jul 2015.

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  1. monkeyarmy

    monkeyarmy Well-Known Member

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    I have always loved Monkey World their message was spot on I thought and as the primates were treated as individuals and not just profit making machines which is some times happens at zoos. Jim, Alison and Jeremy seemed genuinely passionate about rescuing primates.

    When they joined the breeding program I reasoned that the cute baby orangs etc were much better of in their care than in the average zoo and the money they'd bring in would go towards rescuing primates. However, since Jim passed the place has gone down hill, not physically but in terms of their message or morals for want of a better term.

    As I'm sure most people know Monkey World was founded by Jim Cronin to offer a home to chimps confiscated form photographers using them as props on Spanish beaches. A friend of mine contacted them on their Facebook page about a capuchin being dressed up and used as a photographers prop in Benidorm. The response couldn't be more apathetic if they tried. She got a response along the lines of O well that's the law, which would be 'fine' if this wasn't an organisation founded for the protection of chimps in the exact same position and Alison hadn't said on national TV that it didn't matter if the primate was endangered or not Monkey World will rescue them. Clearly all primates are equal but some are more equal.

    I have personally contacted them about the Banana Derby which straps capuchins dressed up as cowboys to dogs and races them. It travels the round USA at fairs and private events. Now to me this is awful animal abuse. Again the response might as well have been what eves. I also sent them pictures of macaques being used as photographers props in Moscow in the depths of winter, which is very cold, not macaque friendly weather at all. This time I didn't even get a response. Now I'm not nieve and I know MW can't save all the primates and fight all legislation but they don't even seem to try anymore. Other than their petition and presenting evidence in a parliamentary review on the primate pet trade but Alison contradicted herself and was speaking through the other panels presentation. Much smaller organisations with much smaller budgets are doing much more.


    Along similar lines myself and many others have contacted them about marmosets that are in desperate in need of rehoming but MW won't do anything about it claiming there is no room. However, on Monkey Life they recue pleanty of marmosets and they even made a video of Alison rescuing a marmoset last week, do they only rescue marmosets when a camera is pointed at them? They say they have no space for more marmosets but what are they going to do when all those baby orangs grow up? Especially as orang adult males will not co-habit.

    In the keepers talk about the Woolley monkeys the keeper said that the woolies were being breed as numbers are reducing in the wild, which is a tad misleading as it wouldn't be unreasonable for those listening to conclude that the offspring are being breed to be returned to the wild. Which is miss leading as most of the woolies bred in captivity are hybrids and carry a virus that is not present in wild populations so it would be irresponsible to return them to the wild. Also seeing as they have produced many more males than females it would be responsible to stop breeding for a while. I guess this point could be levelled at any zoo part of the breeding programe but MW sells it's self as a rescue centre. If they keep breeding the primates on the programme in the near future the primates they've breed could start creeping very close to the number they have rescued.

    I visited a couple of weeks ago on a hot Saturday, the kind of day that is going to attract large crowds to a zoo or a rescue centre. Which you'd think would increase the amount of educational staff you have working about the place right? Not at Monkey World there were zero staff members about. Some people were banging on the glass off one of the chimp enclosures annoying the chimps, I went looking for a keeper to get them to stop after they told me to f#ck off. As I said there were no keepers about but I came across a wedding. The wedding party was being guarded by four members of staff to keep us plebs away. Another member of staff was directing guests from the gate to the venue despite there being very good signage. So that's 4 staff for wedding guests 0 for primates.

    The morons moved away from the chimps so I continued my visit, ending up in the restaurant for lunch. There were that many staff people were just standing around. The situation was the same in the shop. Now obviously people that work in the shop are unlikely to be able to work in the park as education staff or keepers. But the staff ratios seem to scream that the areas where the park makes money are considered more important to staff than staff to answer guests questions or take the opportunity to educate the public and get their message across. And of course make sure people are keeping to the rules.

    I take my hat off to the marketing team, they certainly know how to sell themselves. This was evidenced last week with their fundraiser attached to the marmoset rescue last week. If you donate £1000 you get to meet Alison which I thought was rather steep, to meet the pope you only have to have dirty feet! Monkey World feels more and more like a conventional zoo.

    Am I being overly harsh on monkey world? Has anyone else 'gone off' their favourite zoo? Any ideas for a replacement for Monkey World?
     
  2. Zooplantman

    Zooplantman Well-Known Member

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    Frankly you are being overly harsh about just about everyone and everything.
    What positive improvements come from such an attitude?

    Perhaps you might go to work for this organization you have so long admired and help them with their mission.Do positive change rather than harsh on others' work. Just don't work on the customer service end, not your strength.
     
  3. aquilla1

    aquilla1 Active Member

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    I suspect there is more to this venomous diatribe than meets the eyes!!

    Monkey World is awesome!!
     
  4. monkeyarmy

    monkeyarmy Well-Known Member

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    Yes there is the fact I too thought Monkey World was awesome but their recent reluctance to rescue monkeys in need has tarnished my opinion. Their all over chimps and orangs but not worth the effort for a common marmoset or capuchin.
     
  5. garyjp

    garyjp Well-Known Member

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    One thing is for sure is that when Monkey Army starts a post its usually a cue to start up a hornets nest.We have locked horns before and you are a bit of an idealist.
    I would suggest that you contact other zoos and rescue centres and please clarify your marmoset statement are these just cases you have heard or are you in direct contact with people over certain animals
     
  6. monkeyarmy

    monkeyarmy Well-Known Member

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    Nope animals I have or in the process of seeking new homes for. I was understanding as it a national problem due to the fact it is no harder to buy a marmoset with very complex needs than it is a hamster with straight forward needs. I belived like most supporters of Monkey World that they were trying the best for primates. But seeing the video of a marmoset being rescued that was in excellent condition and whilst not ideal conditions had a much better living standards than any of the marmots I have sought help for really upset and angered me, they are picking the easy rescues. Then to see the reply my mate got about the capuchin just put the boot in.

    I've been a supporter of monkey world since I was 5 and have got an adoption every year since for my birthday. So I feel genuinely hurt and let down by MW's attitude
     
  7. stubeanz

    stubeanz Well-Known Member

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    Do you actually have marmosets now then?
     
  8. garyjp

    garyjp Well-Known Member

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    I dont know the ins and outs of monkey world but i would say that their record is extremely good - did they not rescue 80 odd capuchins a few years ago from Bolivia ? I cant remember if there are 2/3 groups of capuchins but you expect them to go after one capuchin in Spain where neither you or I know the spanish law with regard to these monkeys , get it , bring it back, have vetinary checks , build it a new enclosure and then try and introduce it to a large established group. Capuchins are vicious in the wild and will often kill each other.If this is purely then down to a financial decision well yes i understand.
     
  9. garyjp

    garyjp Well-Known Member

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    and if so how many and what do you have ?
     
  10. monkeyarmy

    monkeyarmy Well-Known Member

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    No if I was in a position to house the marmosets why would I ask monkey world to house them?

    It's not about rescuing just one capuchin. It's about the fact they put all the effort in getting Spain to ban the use of chimps but won't do the same for other species. What makes a chimp worth protecting that a capuchin doesn't have? Especially as capuchins will remain 'workable' much longer, so the hellish experience can be life long.

    Yes they rescued 88 capuchins from a Chilean lab a massive operation which I'm willing to bet most zoos wouldn't have done. Which makes it more baffling why they won't even try to get legislation changed


    btw chimps also kill each other and other primates in the wild and are much harder to intergrate into groups and that hasn't stopped them rescuing chimps and credit where it is due they have rescued many very psychologically damaged chimps.
     
  11. Reggie Kray

    Reggie Kray Member

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    Dr. Allison Cronin and her staff continue to do a first class job at Monkey World , after the death of her husband Jim Cronin, Monkey Army, I understand your compassion for animals and their welfare, I like reading what you post, you are a good kid with strong views, I appreciate that, but as for Monkey World and what they have done, are doing, and I am sure will continue to do, just one word, RESPECT.
     
  12. monkeyarmy

    monkeyarmy Well-Known Member

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    You're spot on Reggie, they have done so much built an amazing park run two charities, have done things no other place has done or are willing to do. I believe the were the first to use just electric fencing to contain chimps.

    All this makes it more frustrating that they don't seem all that bothered anymore.
     
  13. Reggie Kray

    Reggie Kray Member

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    Remember when Allison, not long after her husband died took in a staggering 90 monkeys which had been used for scientific research, what a magnificent thing to do. But remember, and I have been in business all my life that they have to have plenty of money coming in to finance these projects, money does not come easy, hence in your recent visit plenty of café and gift shop staff, I agree it is wrong for badly behaved visitors to be annoying the primates and no staff available to stop them, do they have volunteers at Monkey World who could be useful in the role of keeping a watchful eye on things?
     
  14. Reggie Kray

    Reggie Kray Member

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    Your comments have been noted dear tea drinker from Darlington, I reiterate RESPECT
     
  15. Reggie Kray

    Reggie Kray Member

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    Hope to discuss this thread later if I don't get banned off by the powers that be, sweet dreams zoo chatters:)
     
  16. Reggie Kray

    Reggie Kray Member

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    Respect has to be earned, you have not earned any, come to think of it have you ever earned anything in your life, probably not too busy trying to act the big clever git on here, well lets see at the end of the day who is clever
     
  17. Reggie Kray

    Reggie Kray Member

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    My twin brother Ronnie wishes to join this discussion group, does he have to start an account of his own or can he share mine?, hope I haven't made any spelling mistakes, don't want to get 100 lines of that teacher. thank you for your assistance, RESPECT, Reggie.
     
  18. Thaumatibis

    Thaumatibis Well-Known Member

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    If monkey world takes every marmoset they're asked to take, what message will it send? It's okay to have any pet you want, even if you don't know a thing about it, because if it ends up badly, a sanctuary will take it?
    And what makes monkey world different from a zoo? They display and breed animals so the public can learn about them.
    If you think all life is equal, you have a lot to learn. Take a predator-prey relationship. Either the prey gets eaten or the predator dies of hunger. Would an equal world allow a kill or be killed situation? Think about it.

    ~ Thaumatibs
     
  19. FunkyGibbon

    FunkyGibbon Moderator Staff Member

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    It would send the message that Monkey World is good at being a sanctuary. Car manufacturers don't occasionally make cars without seatbelts in order to show that it's not okay to drive dangerously. Sanctuaries are specifically intended to bail out people who cannot responsibly care for exotic pets. That does not in any way mean they support these individuals.
    I haven't visited and can't comment on the general discussion of this thread. This is just a specific point I noticed.
     
  20. monkeyarmy

    monkeyarmy Well-Known Member

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    Why does it look like I'm talking to myself? People think I'm mad enough here as it is.

    I don't think it does send the message that keeping primates as pets is ok especially as they make their stance on primates as pets very clear. But even if it did send that message it's not the marmosets fault. It's he same reason we don't let kids die of starvation in this country to teach their parents they can't afford children.


    The predator pray analogy is also off the point seeing as Monkey World is a sanctuary not a lion hunting zebra to feed its self.
     
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