Fair enough Sooty.... The enclosure was probaby OK but the location and door opening and closing all the time were very annoying and I think probably contributed to the Potto's being difficult to see. There are no animals in this enclosure now - it is boarded up. Same at the other end where the monitor lizards used to be. As stated elsewhere, the small animal collection appears to be diminishing rapidly which is a shame as it's something they could put right quite easily imo. I agree with practically everything you have said about Marwell in this and other threads, and rally have statred to wonder what's going on at the zoo. It all seesm so stagnant..... Let's hope some one takes a strong lead.......
Shame about the potto,it could be a bit hit & miss whether you saw tem and the automatic door I agree was irritating,but still another sad loss to the diminishing collection. So, Marwell has lost another 5 mammal species in 2011 and added nothing, following the pattern of the last few years,every year they seem to lose one or two-babirussa,pudu,diana monkey,cusimanse are some that spring to mind, but nothing ever seems to replace them & quite often enclosures are just demolished and areas left bare & forgotten about. I couldn't understand why for ages the old lion enclosure stood empty,if they didnt want to keep lions , then surely it would have been adequate for another species. I know they housed the anteaters there for while so can't have been beyond use. The only new mammals I can think of in last few years are the return of tapirs & black wildebeast,welcome, but hardly makes up for the species they keep 'losing'. Now they seem to be doing the same with birds to. I really hope Marwell has a surprise or two in store this year....I wont hold my breth though!
I agree with the other comments that marwell seems to be stagnating, and its shocking that so many species have left the collection with no additions. Im still baffled why an established ungulate holder got rid of a herd of gemsbok, and can only presume they were hybrid or want to source the east african variety of oryx instead (they're near threatened, and gemsbok are least concern on UN database), but marwell seems to be showing no interest in acquiring new species of late. There have been rumours of gorillas for several years but with so many new batchelor groups setting up around the country, I suspect this is now on the back burner. The plan for the african valley was always to open at 25 acres with a few species then once expanded to 45 acres (i think this has now been done) to add more species. Roan antelope and greater kudu would do well here and both species are from east africa so would fit with the theme. I dont think the rhino will ever go here as so much strong fencing would be needed and the other species there are east african not south. Maybe the black wildebeest could move in with the rhino if the kudu moved. To be honest, without the african valley field and the restaurant opening up in the last few years, regular visitors could easily be led to believe that the park is winding down and gradually shutting, as little else of significance has happened around the park (that encounter village really isn't that great, lest be honest) and species have deserted the park. As others said, so many enclosures have been demolished over the years and just grassed over. But with the valley field, new restaurant, desert house and new meerkat enclosure, that corner of the zoo really has been developed well, and I really hope that this is a show of what will gradually happen around the rest of the zoo over the coming years. The australia bit is a bit poor, if the netted over the wallaby bit it could house parakeets/lorikeets etc. If the camel paddock next door was used for red kangaroo and emu, the area would be a proper australian biome as per the original plan. Does anyone know the latest on the plans for the new entrance? It was due to contain a new shop/cafe/toilets and conservation exhibits and be on the site of the old restaurant, but it looks expensive and i can't see it happening anytime soon. Marwell Adaptation and Entrance Project | Ray Hole looks nice, but expensive and no animal exhibits incorporated.
I wonder where they will go to? This is a herd/group species and I rather hope it might be to join one of the other two pairs at Trotters or Newquay, but more probably not.
I really hope they aren't going to spend a fortune on a new entrance, poor as the existing one may be, it's not an expensive entrance area most people visit the zoo for, its animals and Marwell's range of species is diminishing year on year. Far better to spend the money on new exhibits and new species!
Should say thread.- but in all seriousness I did read on a thread that they were phasing them out. Nanook posted it on the thread below. http://www.zoochat.com/38/my-monthly-updates-2011-1-a-239644/index8.html
I have a nasty theory that Marwell is deliberately being wound down-the government plans for housing expansion in the area extend from Bishop's Waltham towards Winchester. All that parkland suddenly coming on the market in a few years when the property prices pick up? The corporation could sell it for a fortune and make themselves very very rich. And in the meantime they've got a nice little earner in a zoo that is clearly living on its past reputation. The current board have cut all ties with the original creator and show no signs of any reapproachment with Dr Knowles, who is now rather elderly. This should have been resolved by now if they truly had any intention to do so. Why has the most enthusiastic promoter of Marwell on these boards disappeared completely? Why has no-one on the board or a member tacked the board about their policies? I may sound paranoid but I reckon I'm onto something here. I'd like to hear someone from the zoo deny it formally.
I don't think you're being paranoid gary, there is definately an air of cricket st thomas about the place. The loss of so many species, grassing over of so many exhibits, such half arsed attempts at new exhibits (encounter village, graze cafe - its far too small and of cheap construction - siamang enclosure) and so many other left dormant (old lion enclosure, pudu enclosure, potto house) do not give the impression of a park looking to expand like chester, noahs ark, longleat et al. The rural nature of the area and fierceness of local communities, and i think some AONBs nearby mean that i think housing developments over the whole park and in the area are unlikely (it's greenbelt land), but i do wander if the commercial/leisure aspect will take over. Remember, one of the old somali wild ass paddocks by the okapi has now been turned into an events field for wedding receptions and conferences and these are where the park will make its money. Give it a few years, i think there will be another hotel and a spa on the site (ala chessington and cricket st thomas, and essentially longleat too). They'll frankly make the committee more money. A herd of gemsbok and 3 black wildebesst somehow doesn't have the same commercial potential.
This is the only example of its kind in the UK zoo world that I know of- where the Founder(or family) now has no connection with a major collection that is still in existence. I find this very intruging and wonder exactly how it came about?
I have indeed had that feeling on each of my more recent visits- particularly the most recent one, though its a considerably bigger animal collection. I think you may have something in so much as their focus could well be on 'Leisure' in the future- rather than 'Animal Conservation' -or in equal amounts anyway.
Maybe this arguement is lost on me? What / who is now behind MW? (I had qualms with the recent name change ...). I agree though that Marwell seems to have lost some of its shine. Other than the hoofstock and some carnivores ... there does not seem to be much direction to the place and indeed having phased out a lot of species without anything significant in return. BTW, that Encounter Village and the Australian Outback area are a sad laughing stock ... Some more imaginative work could have done something meaningful in that area (as also in the type of species and what theming ... should be done).
I'm glad that others share my incomprehension concerning the name change. "Marwell Wildlife" could be anything from a nature reserve to an art gallery, and I find it very hard to believe that families in Portsmouth, Eastleigh and Southampton refer to the park as being anything other than a zoo. Which it is, and what is wrong with that?
I actually think Marwell is pretty scarred by a period of lots of zoo-style construction. I never liked the 'heart of Africa' house, and with maybe the exception of the Aridlands houses I don't think these exhibits make the buildings look anything less like ungulate barns. I wonder if the penguin exhibit really made sense financially and in terms of visitor numbers. The gibbons have what you'd expect from an urban zoo with no available stands of trees - you only have to look at Dudley or Monkey World to see whats possible for less money. Species departures aside, I'm actually quite optimistic about the recent direction they are taking, with the African valley and cheetah exhibit. I think Marwell needs to capitalise on its landscape instead of trying to diversify the collection further. Even if they reduce species further, I think the impact of vast open 'reserves' is the way to show grassland and desert ungulates in contemporary zoological collections. I just wish they'd locate their forest species beside or in the ample woodland they have at their site. As for using paddock space for private functions, I think this actually makes sound financial sense, they have a stately home in the grounds, London did this with the Mappin Cafe, its a high-value use of a tiny fraction of the land, and its not as if Marwell isn't expanding its paddock space at the moment anyway.
If you haven't read My Marwellous Life (cheesy, I know!) by John Knowles himself then I seriously recommend you do with regards to what happend between Marwell and himself... [ame="http://www.amazon.co.uk/My-Marwellous-Life-Zoos-Conservation/dp/1846243653/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1330953698&sr=8-2"]My Marwellous Life: In Zoos and Conservation: Amazon.co.uk: John Knowles: Books[/ame] Just to clarify over Marwell's current ownership... It's in the hands of a charitable trust (same situation as Chester) that is overseen by a board of trustee's
Nisha, i don't really fancy buying the book (or reading, generally), can you provide us amatuers with a couple of clues if you know? In summary, why is he now so wholly unconnected with the park? To be fair to marwell, they have done a good job of the cheetah exhibit, and added 45 more acres of paddock in the last 2 years which im sure will hold more species soon, and the new formal gardens are also well thought out and executed. They did make a good effort with life in the trees and the mix of animals in that relatively small area is very diverse and interesting, even if the siamang bit is quite crap. I actually think the enclosure isn't that bad, but the problem is the bar has been raised so high with regard to keeping primates (e.g. monkey world, port lympne and howletts) that as aesthetically (i dont care if it's spelt wrong) pleasing as marwells is, it just doesn't cut the mustard anymore. The encounter village is a bit naff but it pulls families to the far end of the park and keeps alot of the children away from me (and my blood presure down). The valley field, to be fair, is one of the best exhibits i've ever seen - simple, spacious and effective. Well, it would be if they actually stuck some bloody animals in it.
Yes, just a single paragraph summary of what happened would suffice. If its in his book its obviously in the public domain. Re the Siamang enclosure- I do find it strange an enclosure like that was built- in this day and age- that was so unsuitable for the inhabitants i.e. 100% aethsetically pleasing, but almost O % in suitability for arboreal primates! I cannot imagine that happening at e.g. Howletts/Port Lympne where the reverse is normally the case though their recent new enclosures have incorporated both needs. I would almost go as far as saying keeping Siamangs in this enclosure is cruel as it denies them their normal forms of locomotion- the ladder-like frame recently added for them to swing on is hardly going to improve things greatly. I also agree the Valley Field is an excellent location and one of the best paddocks I've seen too, but its still not made full use of. Again very strange.
